When Hitting, the push on #1 is with the right triceps. When Swinging it's the right shoulder which is pushing on #1, which pushes on the left arm, which pulls the left shoulder, which pulls the shaft, and when the left arm blasts off, it's still pulling the shaft, so you should call it what it is, Swinging.
The left shoulder never drives - it is always driven, by either the right shoulder or right triceps. The left shoulder, like the left arm, is passive, whether Hitting or Swinging. The right shoulder is the only one which can drive.
How does the pulling motion in the down stroke by a swinger work? Isn't this a left arm action?
How does the pulling motion in the down stroke by a swinger work? Isn't this a left arm action?
When Swinging , for pivot strokes there is no "left arm pulling action". That is to say the left arm is inert, string like and is pulled by the left shoulder only. For a swingers Pull Minor Basic , one accumulator, stroke , the Pivot is zeroed and the Left Arm itself does the pulling . You don't see this shot on tv very often but it is a logical shot given Homers catalogue of available options. Dave Stockton putts this way apparently despite the fact he sets up like he's about to Push Basic .
Think about this way ... to pull with the left arm in a pivot stroke is to pull the left arm away from the chest, an early release of #4. Hmmm not sure about short Full Sweep Release Pivot Strokes .... there might be a little left arm pulling there, gotta check that out on the range. Yoda'd know, he is a magician with that shot. Luke Donald isn't bad at it either.
When Swinging , for pivot strokes there is no "left arm pulling action". That is to say the left arm is inert, string like and is pulled by the left shoulder only. For a swingers Pull Minor Basic , one accumulator, stroke , the Pivot is zeroed and the Left Arm itself does the pulling . You don't see this shot on tv very often but it is a logical shot given Homers catalogue of available options. Dave Stockton putts this way apparently despite the fact he sets up like he's about to Push Basic .
Think about this way ... to pull with the left arm in a pivot stroke is to pull the left arm away from the chest, an early release of #4. Hmmm not sure about short Full Sweep Release Pivot Strokes .... there might be a little left arm pulling there, gotta check that out on the range. Yoda'd know, he is a magician with that shot. Luke Donald isn't bad at it either.
Thanks,O.B. as always.
I got caught up by the pulling versus pushing.
I thought that was LA vs RA, but the pulling could perhaps be more in in both hands like tugging?
I have probably not been pulling at all - more like OTT right shoulder throwing away... I'm sorry to say.. so this is mostly just a theoretical question on my part.. but I'm eager to learn..
I got caught up by the pulling versus pushing.
I thought that was LA vs RA, but the pulling could perhaps be more in in both hands like tugging?
I have probably not been pulling at all - more like OTT right shoulder throwing away... I'm sorry to say.. so this is mostly just a theoretical question on my part.. but I'm eager to learn..
The Hands are just clamps, hitting or swinging. The pull of swinging is with the body for pivot strokes, fuller shots. When you get the Macdonald drills going , flowing the body throws the arms off ........advanced MacDonald drills will have a little right arm pick up and a little throw at the bottom perhaps but thats for another day.
Take a golf club and with it approx parallel to the ground and behind you as if in Release pre impact hook the club head around something. A hand rail, the upright on a golf cart , your caddies hands . Now forget golf moves , de program all you know about golf. I want you to pull this club length wise like a rope in a tug of war game. Pull it . Did you employ some golf moves , spinning hips or something ? Don't . Pull on the rope . Homer said "pull with whatever you can pull with , pull with your ears if you want". Do you feel how your body is braced , your feet are planted and solid , how your using your weight and your core and not your arms only .
This is easiest to see with the imaginary tug of war rope parallel to the ground but in golf for the swinger this longitudinal acceleration , pulling on the rope length wise , arrow from quiver deal actually begins in Startdown . It is the opposite of radial acceleration and delays release so long as the club shaft is moving in a linear manner . Once it move outside the hands radially , CF throws the club head out.
So the "rope" you need to pull longitudinally , length wise , in Startdown is positioned more like in the following diagram from George Knudson. Here was a master describing Homers longitudinal acceleration , pulling , drag loading , downswing sequence in his own words. Body pulls arms. Is this pivot to hands? Not so long as you are directing with the #3 pp. See the top arrow in his diagram and the direction it is pointing in......away from the ball and target!!!! The hands here are moving 3 dimensionally BACWARDS, Down and Out. OTT moves would have the arrow pointed more at the ball the Hands moving FORWARDS , Down and Out. Shortening your backswing to 3/4 or Top will really help when ingraining a longitudinal pull. Try it with little shots first where your hands don't get far enough back to necessitate the "opposite direction" to the target or ball pull at Top . Start with Acquired Motion and then work it to Total Motion. You can even have a little longitudinal in longer chip shots..... in fact thats a great place to feel its magic. It will change your impact immediately. No more laying the turf over a chip via throw away. Simply put you can't throw away if you are in the process of pulling longitudinally.
The Hands are just clamps, hitting or swinging. The pull of swinging is with the body for pivot strokes, fuller shots. When you get the Macdonald drills going , flowing the body throws the arms off ........advanced MacDonald drills will have a little right arm pick up and a little throw at the bottom perhaps but thats for another day.
Take a golf club and with it approx parallel to the ground and behind you as if in Release pre impact hook the club head around something. A hand rail, the upright on a golf cart , your caddies hands . Now forget golf moves , de program all you know about golf. I want you to pull this club length wise like a rope in a tug of war game. Pull it . Did you employ some golf moves , spinning hips or something ? Don't . Pull on the rope . Homer said "pull with whatever you can pull with , pull with your ears if you want". Do you feel how your body is braced , your feet are planted and solid , how your using your weight and your core and not your arms only .
This is easiest to see with the imaginary tug of war rope parallel to the ground but in golf for the swinger this longitudinal acceleration , pulling on the rope length wise , arrow from quiver deal actually begins in Startdown . It is the opposite of radial acceleration and delays release so long as the club shaft is moving in a linear manner . Once it move outside the hands radially , CF throws the club head out.
So the "rope" you need to pull longitudinally , length wise , in Startdown is positioned more like in the following diagram from George Knudson. Here was a master describing Homers longitudinal acceleration , pulling , drag loading , downswing sequence in his own words. Body pulls arms. Is this pivot to hands? Not so long as you are directing with the #3 pp. See the top arrow in his diagram and the direction it is pointing in......away from the ball and target!!!! OTT moves would have the arrow pointed more at the ball. Shortening your backswing to 3/4 or Top will really help when ingraining a longitudinal pull. Try it with little shots first where your hands don't get far enough back to necessitate the "opposite direction" to the target or ball pull at Top .
Nice.
I'll put it in my post collection and see if I'm able to use this in a meaningful way as soon as possible.
__________________
HP, grant me the serenity to accept what I cannot change, the courage to change what I can, and the wisdom to know the difference. Progress and not perfection is the goal every day!
#4 Motion is dependent on several variables
procedure
plane angle
delivery line
hand path
loading
right shoulder dual agent motion
hip motion
knee action
very much depends on pattern....
All this ideally is compliant with the selected loading...
I am considering , when I started this thread, getting the shoulders free to do what they seem to do best- turn around the spine and transmit energy to and as part of the power package- pivot.
The shoulders-full stroke- turn 100 + degrees top to impact and another 100 + to finish. The #4 is maybe 45 degrees top to followthrough.
I am trying to stay away from a new "trick" or compensation for every stroke variation by getting the choulders on track.
hb
CORRECTION- The shoulder turn is not as I stated- the shoulders turn is only about 50 deg. to the next leading/lagging component-the hips. I should have said the pivot -including the shoulders is 110 +/- deg top to impact. the #4 accumulator is limited by by checkrein to about 45 deg. (from the shoulder) which is the range of #4 accumulator.
Last edited by HungryBear : 07-02-2012 at 07:26 AM.
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